THE INSTITUTE OF TEXAN CULTURES
ORAL HISTORY PROGRAM
INTERVIEW WITH: George Stumberg
DATE: August 26, 1989
PLACE: 8210 Countryside, San Antonio, Texas
INTERVIEIi/ER: Don Glessner
G: Since the middle part of the nineteenth century as I
recall, am I correct in that?
S: The best that I can determine, the original person who
came to San Antonio, Herman Deitrich Stumberg, about 1847,
so, yes, about the middle of the past century.
G: Did he come from Germany?
S: Not directly to San Antonio, no, he came to Missouri
from Germany and lived there, with what I have determined to
be two other brothers, until he came to Texas in 1847. I
think he probably came in the neighborhood of, oh, he
probably lived there since, roughly 1840.
G: OK. So they had been in this country seven or eight
years before he joined the march down to Texas. Let's see,
1847 Texas was an independent republic.
S: That's right.
G: That's not long, that's ten or eleven years after the
Alamo fell.
S: That's right.
G: Been ••.• this town a long time. Had he been in the,
he opened a drygoods business, as I recall, in San Antonio,
is that correct?
STUMBERG 2
S: Actually, he did not. He purchased land in 1863 which
is still in the family, part of which is still in the
family, and he and his son, and predominately I think his
son, opened the general mercantile, what I described as the
general mercantile business in, actually, prior to 1870.
But the building, the original building that we can trace it
back to, was built in 1870. It has that date on it. I think
he was in business a short time at another location prior to
building that building.
G: That piece of property is in the downtown, what we call
the downtown section today?
S: Right. It's the block to the s outhwest of the original
courthouse, or what we know as the old courthouse
G: OK. There was some work done in the not too distant
past, I think, to rehab or to remodel ...
S: Yeah, we did an extensive restoration and conversion of
some of the newer, (there are no new buildings), but some of
the newer ones were converted and the old orig inal
buildings, two buildings restored and that was started in
about 1982, roughly.
G: Let me test your memory a little bit. Let's go back to
the 1860s when the land was first bought and, if I
understand, went into business. This is going to be your
great, great grandfather we're talking about.
S: Along with his son.
G: Along with his son. OK, into the mercantile business.
Very successful as I understand, rather prominent
businessmen in this city in the second part of the
STUMBERG 3
G: nineteenth century.
S: Yes, I think they were. The original Herman Deitrich
had established himself, that's the original one that carne
from Missouri, had established himself here by 1852, to the
point that he was able to be elected an alderman, a city .. ,
equivalent to what we have as a city councilman .••
G: A city councilman, yes.
S: And who was evidently quite successful in his dealings
financially. He operated this business, I think, very
successfully. It was a business built upon serving the
agrarian community and I would think, particularly from
family stories, and who turns up that knows the family
today, it was probably concentrated a great deal to towns to
the south of San Antonio; what we know today as Lytle,
Poteet, Pleasanton, so on.
The stories are that the farmers would corne in in their
buckboards and there was a large campyard behind the store.
They would park there overnight, load up with their goods;
check their guns. They would check their guns at the store
which was about two blocks to the south of Military Plaza
which was a center of entertainment type of activities.
They would walk the two blocks north and have their beer or
whatever and corne back and sleep overnight underneath the
buckboards in the campyard and the next morning they'd go
horne with a load of goods.
G: So a trip to town was at least a two day trip •.•
S: Most of the time a two day trip, right.
G: I think too, it would be interesting in terms of how
STUMBERG 4
G: your ancestors went about getting their supplies. The
railroad wasn't here yet, I don't think. I'm not sure. Did
most of it come in by sea?
S: I don't know. I cannot answer that. What I can tell
you that was evidently unique - I've seen written up a
couple of places, was that he had·a particular method in his
business that he bought nothing but except for cash. He
used no credit to put inventory in his store, yet almost all
of the sales of the store were on a credit basis, because an
agrarian community would have once or twice a year, they ·
would have income and they'd come in and payoff their bills
in that point in time, and I think they probably may have
made a small interest carryon the accounts of the people in
that period of time, but as to how the goods got here, I
don't know.
G: That would take a fairly substantial cash outlay up
front, I would think, on his part if he's not using credit
to, er
S: Evidently that would be the case and he had, from all
reports, he had been a successful businessman here prior to
going into this business with his son. They were successful
enough that he had sent his son, George the first, to be
educated in New York City, which is where he was educated,
and the original location of that building, of the business,
not the building, was on South Alamo Street down very close
to what we now know as Pioneer Flour Mills. It was there a
short time; that was the location for a short time prior to
its being moved to the South Flores Street location.
STUMBERG 5
G: Now he was in business with his son. Did the business
stay in the family for another generation?
S: Yes. The business stayed in the family until George
Jr. took the business over from George Sr., died in 1926 • .
He had an untimely, early death as a result of a ruptured
aorta, which was - (we interrupted there for a moment while
the airplane went over and we'll pick it up here.)
S: My grandfather, George Jr.'s untimely death in 1926 was
due to an aneurism that was caused by a gunshot hunting
accident from some years prior to that. At that time my
father, who was employed at National Bank of Commerce, left.
National Bank of Commerce to take over the family business.
He operated that business until the Depression had its
effect on the farming community and it just became
impossible for the farmers to pay the bills that they had
run up on credit.
He simply closed the store and it didn't go bankrupt;
he had to close it because there wasn't enough people left
to pay the bills and he did not pursue at that point in
time, any of the people that owed him money because he felt
that they were the type of people that, if they could pay
him, would by their nature. Had actually had a few people
come by and grant him deeds to their farms because they
could no longer stay on it and work it - the farm - and
couldn't sell it for anything and said that was all they
could do. They knew they owed money and here was the deed
and that was that. We actually have two pieces of property
down there at Poteet today that were the result of the
STUMBERG 6
S: people who came and handed him deeds in lieu of bills
that they had •••
G: It's something of a commentary on the times, isn't it?
I mean the real estate market for example in San Antonio in
the last few years has not been good and the paper is full
of people who just walk away from,the property, walk away
from the loan. And here were, in a previous generation, a
previous work ethic those who could not imagine such a thing
I guess ••.
S: No. Being in the real estate business today and having
a father who was the head of the real estate department of
the National Bank of Commerce until he retired, in 1968, and
looking back at transactions in our family, I will tell you
that the ethic of the environment today is certainly
different than it was in the past.
G: Well, let's go back to the family business and see if a
it was handed down through several generations; it was
obviously going for more than fifty years before it went
out of business as a result of the Depression.
And Herman Deitrich, who would have been your great,
great grandfather if I get all my greats •• , worked with his
son George, who would have been your great grandfather. And
it went from him to his son, George, Jr., who would have
been your grandfather, that was the gentleman, who with the
early death from the aneurism, and then Rudolph, your
father, and closed as we said, as a function of the
Depression in the early Thirties. OK. And your father -
well, in fact your father before him, so back to your
STUMBERG 7
G: grandfather. Let's talk that for a minute, the
National Bank of Commerce. George, Sr., who would h~ve been
your great grandfather
S: Correct.
G: ••. was the first in your family, do I understand, to
be into the banking business?
S: Yes, as far as I know he was one of ten men that
actually founded, that were the ten founders of the National
Bank of Commerce in 1902.
G: 1902. OK. And then your family has' stayed active in
that, in that his son was there •••
S: His son was on the Board of Directors.
G: Board of Directors, OK.
S: My father was the head of the real estate department,
and was employed there a total of 48 years, and the original
stock has pretty much remained in the family until last
year. I found it appropriate to sell mine. I have had to,
that lives in Boerne who still retains part of it, so
its been in the family all that time.
G: You had a couple of interesting stories, that we passed
over a minute ago, stories that have come down through the
family of back again in the latter part of the nineteenth
century, the store, interesting to check your guns as you
come into town, and sleeping under the buckboard in the yard
out back, says a lot about the time and place, I guess.
Things that were going on in San Antonio in that time. Any
other family tid-bits that were passed down that talk about
the, stories that stand out in your mind.
STUMBERG
S: Well, there are a lot of typically family stories.
G: Anything that would be of significant interest?
8
S: Yes, there's one that I can think of that's interesting
to me. In a lot of the earliest documents that I have ever
seen relating to the court in San Antonio, in 1892 George,
Sr., operating the old store, on South Flores and, as I
said, doing a large credit business, and with the people in
the agrarian agricultural community. One of the people who
had large accounts there was the original Sam Maverick.
G: Oh, is that right?
S: (Where the, where I guess we get the name 'maverick'
for the stray calf.) He was a rancher in this area and he
had a, well, to put it nicely, he had a forgetfulness about
his bill.
G: That's nicely put, yes.
S: In other words, he decided that he didn't want to pay
it. I don't know why. But we have the documents from the
court case in 1892, where the 45th District Court of Bexar
County, my father, I'm sorry, my great grandfather, George,
Sr., sued Sam Maverick for the sum of $855, won the case and
got an Abstract of Judgment against Sam Maverick. And maybe
the most interesting thing about that that I know of in
looking at the documents, Mr. Maverick was required to pay
not only the $855.68, but he was required to pay the court
costs in addition, and the court costs for the case in
District Court were $6.25. And I think it's interesting to
look at this, recording it on the docket was 40f, issuing
the citation and return was $1.50, the filing of all the
STUMBERG 9
S: necessary papers was 30f, the entering of the judgment
was 75f, the assessing of the damages was 50f, then the
Sheriff charge for executing the citation was $1.50, the
jury fee for having the jury file was 50f, and that comes to
a grand total of $6.25.
G: I imagine that $800 judgment -was a lot of money I guess
in the 1890s.
S: I would think, if you look at that on an adjusted
basis, that was some sum of money.
G: Did he get his money, or did he just get the judgment?
S: The story is that he got his money, but I don't know
about that. I can't tell you that. All I can tell you is
that a copy of the Abstract of Judgment or I guess the
original Abstract of Judgment, a copy of the court charges.
Another thing that was interesting to me was that he -
George, Sr., and Herman were very entrepenurial, evidently
in their nature. We have as assignment of patent rights,
where in 1884, they paid $500 for the rights to a patent on
a butter churn.
G: Oh, is that right?
S: Ye ah. When you think about the value of money again,
just to have the patent rights on a butter churn and to pay
$500 for it at that point in time was quite a ---
G: A lot of money.
S: That was quite an investment. We have, they were very
active, very active in business. We have somehow retained
an abnormal amount of the records of that, compared to some
people. I think it's because we just didn't throw anything
STUMBERG 10
S: away. We've got loads of old, interesting stock
certificates that George, Sr., invested in that are, at this
time, worthless. The certificates are neat, but, they're
worthless. We've got such famous San Antonio and southwest
companies as the Chamber of Commerce and Businessman's Club,
the Texas Wirelss Telegraph Telephone Company, the St.
Anthony Improvement Company, the Superior Oil Company, The
Commercial Motor Company, the Santa Ana Industrial Company,
the Coliseum League of San Antonio, The Royal Sarcoghagus
Company, the Standard Coal Company, the Cinco De Mayo Mining
and Smelting Company and the San Antonio and Aransas Pass
Railroad Company. So those are just a few of them that we've
pulled out. There're a bunch more of them but, unfortunate­ly,
we don't have as many stock certificates in companies
that made it as we do in companies that didn't make it.
G: Well, you're not alone there. So you get a picture of
a family that's been very active in the business community
in San Antonio for a long time.
S: Evidently.
G: Evidently. Interesting. Very interesting. OK. Now
we take the business and the mercantile business down
through roughly the Depression as you said. It folded as a
result of the economic hard times of the Depression. And
your story there on Sam Maverick is good, while most folk
paid their bills, not everyone did, and life goes on. So
that the store then was closed down and the property, if I
remember what you said, remains in the family; some of it
was developed here just recently.
STUMBERG 11
S: Yes, that's correct.
G: And that's office space?
S: Actually, the property was bigger, part of it remains
in the family. I .know the property used to go farther south
than it did because my grand and great grandmother gave the
property to the city when they wanted to build Stumberg
Street, the magnificent two block long street. And I know
she donated that property to the city so it went down at
least that far, and possibly further than that. I don't
know the actual bounds of the original parcel. -
G: OK. Let's stop right there. - OK, we're back. We
paused there again while the airplane went overhead.
George, let's go back and talk a little bit about some
of the ancestors, some of the other ancestors, perhaps, in
the Stumberg family that we haven't touched on here.
S: One of the family descendants who was a Stumberg, was
Mayo r McAllister, Mayor Walter McAllister's mother, and it
was interesting, and I don't know all of the brothers and
sisters at that particular juncture, but it was interesting
t o see how in those times, and I understand that this was
typical fr om talking t o people in the family, but at that
generation when things were divided up, classes of things
went to, or certain types of property went to different
individuals. One individual went away with all of the land
that the family held. The mayor's mother, the story is, went
away with all the jewelry that the family had, and I would
suspect that that's true because nobody else that I know of
has any of the jewelry in the family. My grandfather,
STUMBERG 12
S: rather great grandfather, came away with the business.
That was his, that's what he inherited out of it, so it
wasn't something everybody divided more like we think of
today, and something divided by class or property. As I
said, the mayor's mother was a Stumberg.
There are a couple of Stumbergs that went, from that
same generation, that went to West Texas and about the time
of the Depression and obtained large ranches. Steve
Stumberg and Whitelaw Stumberg were two that went there.
They ranched all the rest of their lives near Longfellow.
Steve ranched about 120,000 acres and Whitelaw ranched about
80,000 acres in that part of the country.
There's another Stumberg that I have been told of many
times, although he does not corne out of our particular
sector of the family, that of Herman Deitrich, and that is a
person with my same name, George Rudolph Stumberg, but is a
descendant of other Stumbergs in the Missouri group that
were the original people here. He was a Professor of Law at
the University of Texas Law School and he taught Admirality
Law and Criminal Law. I am continually questioned by
attorneys that I know or meet as to whether I'm related to
him. He seems to be very famous in that, not only having
taught for many, many years there, that he wrote, evidently
wrote a treatise on criminal jurisdiction that is the
definitive work and that still today, many lawyers use and
refer to.
Another interesting thing about ancestors is, I have
never seen the name Stumberg outside of the state of Texas
STUMBERG 13
S: in my life until two years ago when I was driving at
the foot of the San Juan National Forest by Lake Wyacita,
Colorado, and looked up and there was a sign on the side of
the road that said 'Dick and Roberta Stumberg,' and I pulled
in there and introduced myself to a gentleman about sixty
years old who was - is the descendant from another Stumberg
out of Missouri. He had heard that there were Stumbergs
that went to Texas, but he had never met, seen, nor heard of
any of those Stumbergs since the whole story that he
remembers from Missouri before he grew up.
And the story in Missouri is that when Herman Deitrich,
and I don't think this corresponds with our history here and
I can understand why, but his story about why Herman
Deitrich left Missouri was that the sheriff was after him
for alienation of affection. He had promised to marry
somebody, some lady, and decided at the last minute that he
didn't want to and left at midnight.
G: Gone t o Texas!
S: Gone to Texas! Maybe that's not an approprite thing to
put in the history, that may upset a lot of people in the
local family.
Another story that is interesting that came out of that
is one of the original Stumbergs, Herman Deitrich was one of
the brothers there, went to California. He was a goldminer,
in fact he was a Forty-niner. He left Missouri penniless.
He alledgedly worked as a laborer in a gold mine in
California for eighteen months and he sailed back and landed
in New York and came back to St. Louis. Lived the rest of
STUMBERG 14
S: his life in St. Louis and literally had chest after
chest full of gold nuggets which nobody could figure out how
he acquired them simplY as a laborer in the mines, but
that's just an interesting aside on one of the other people
in the family; an interesting story.
G: So the gentleman you met by the side of the road in
Colorado, and the gentleman from the University of Texas, I
guess you'd track back to Missouri which would have been
your great great grandfather, Herman Deitrich, your great
great grandfather. He arrived with a couple of brothers
S: Obviously, there had to be a couple of brothers there.
That was the first generation in this country and there had
to be --- I have pieced together that there must have been
three brothers.
G: OK. One last comment or question before we leave.
We'll go back again to Mayor McAlliste r's mother. I think
you did mention t o me once before that there was a rather
definitive history done on the Stumberg family through
her -
S: Ri ght. In 1968 in the bi-centennial year, the Mormon
church did an in-depth, and I unde rstand that this is
something they do, they did an in-depth history on 50 people
that year, one from each state and Mayor McAllister was the
person in San Antonio who was chosen from the State of Texas
to do the history of.
He, since his mother was a Stumberg, then they took the
McAllister family as far as they could take it back, and
STUMBERG 15
S: they took, since his mother was a Stumberg, they took
her family back as far as they could take it. I might have
not read the entire history, although I have read excerpts
from it and this history goes back I understand, to a very
few years to the Magna Carta, the signing of the Magna
Carta.
G: That's back. So someone reading this at some future
point wants to dig deeper into the Stumberg family, there is
some documentation probably in the McAllister chain.
S: There is at least one copy of it here in San Antonio,
presently located at the San Antonio Savings Building and
then I understand, that there are other copies obtainable,
or not obtainable, there's a copy in Salt Lake City where
they, which is the base of their work.
G: Let's change course here for just a minute if we can,
and leave the nineteenth century and the early part of the
twentieth century, and come up to your life. Let's talk
about George R. Stumberg for just a minute. You must have
some prespecti ve on San Antonio, the family's been here so
long. You, I assume were born here.
S: Yes.
G: Is that a safe assumtion?
S: That's a safe assumption.
G: You went to school here?
S: Yes.
G: Can we talk a little bit about your early memories,
your folks, your mother and father?
S: Sure. My dad was very conservative as, evidently almost
STUMBERG 16
S: everyone, maybe everyone in our family would have been.
He was very affected by the Depression; very conscious of
being able to support his mother and the Depression put a
fear into him so that he would not get married until he felt
he could see his way clear for a good long way, maybe the
rest of his life. So, consequentLy, he did not marry until
he was forty.
He married my mother whom he met at National Bank of
Commerce, who was working there. They were married in 1942
and were - I was born in April 1945, I'm an only child.
They lived in the northwest part of San Antonio. All of my
life, actually from the time they married until my father
retired from the bank in 1968.
I remember -- I guess the biggest thing that I can
remember as a child in San Antonio, this is probably true of
other places but, that is in contrast to today, was the
sense of neighborhood that I remember growing up. You could
go anywhere within running distance that your feet would
take you. Everybody knew who you were and the back door was
always open in everybody's house. There was a, I realize
now, there was a tremendous sense of security that was
gained from the fact that these people all lived for long
periods of time in the same neighborhood. I look at our
neighborhoods today and I think one of the things that our
children miss and don't even under - they don't even know
they're missing - one of the things I think they're missing
is the real sense of neighborhood we had as kids. It really
doesn't exist anywhere anymore. Some areas a little more
STUMBERG 17
S: than others, perhaps, but none to the extent I remember
as a child.
G: Let me flip my tape.
END OF TAPE I, SIDE 1, 45 MINUTES.
SIDE 2.
G: George, let's talk a little bit about growing up in San
Antonio in the mid-fifties, I guess, or thereabouts. Take
me back to some of your earlier memories, if you will.
S: Well, I attended Woodlawn Elementary School, all six
years of my elementary school education; went on to the
Horace Mann Junior High School for three years; Jefferson
for three more years. I really don't think that there are a
lot of memories that would be outstanding; they are
outstanding memories but they were typical. As a kid The
things that we did were: play baseball, I remember going to
go fishing at Woodlawn Lake; I don't see people out there
fishing anymore .. I guess there are no fish in that water.
We used to get stringers full of perch out of there. I
remember bicycles being much more important than they are
today. There were lots fewer cars. Most families at that
point in the mid-fifties were still one car families. I
remember the difference that that made and one of the things
you had to do was schedule the automobile. Much more than we
do tOday.
Speaking of the automobile, one of the things that come
to mind is tires .• a great difference. I remember you paid
as much for a set of tires in those days as you do today.
And if you got 8,000 miles out of a set of tires, you
felt •.•
STUMBERG
G: Got your money's worth?
5: You had really done well ... But the bicycle in our
neighborhood, everybody had them and we went everywhere
our parents didn't haul us like parents today do.
18
I remember it was basically a world without air
conditioners. I well remember when we got the first air
conditioner. We may have had the first air conditioner on
the block . . It was a window unit and it was absolutely
incredible. You stand in front of this machine that blew
cold air on you!
I well remember getting our television set. We were
the second family on the block that had a television set. I
remember our next door neighbor was the first family on the
block that had a television set and the purchase of a
television set was such an occurrence that for literally
weeks after this family got their television set, there
would be 25 or 30 people in their front room every evening.
(laughter) Watching this thing. Today, I'd hate to tell
you how many television sets we have in this house. So that
was certainly a major difference.
I look back and maybe it's mostly a function, at least
partially a function of my age then versus my age now but I
really believe that that was a much more tranquil era, a
much more tranquil society than we live in today.
G: A much more mobile society today, I guess.
5: A much more mobile, sure. We have neighborhood
turnover. We have the rubber wheel transportation.
G: Someone said we don't have neighborhoods, we have folks
STUMBERG
G: who live near each other. Neighbor has a certain
connotation of togetherness.
19
S: I remember that, as a very young child, maybe not a
very young child, but by the time I was eight or nine I had
learned how to use the bus system in San Antonio, and I used
the buses to get around.
movie it was nine cents.
I remember that when I went to the
G: Nine cents! That is going back a couple of years. I
shouldn't laugh. I remember nine cents.
S: I remember that at a little older age the serials
ran
G: That's at the movies.
S: That's at the movies, something you just couldn't miss
for a week. Saturday morning and afternoon movie and serial
and double feature was to live for or to die for. Well, I
remember that certainly distance was thought of very
differently than it is tOday. To most people at that time,
New York was still four days and four nights away.
today is five hours ---
G: Five hours by air?
New York
S: I don't remember anybody growing up that I knew, and I
grew up in a very middle class neighborhood, I don't
remember anybody that had been to Europe. I remember that
there was much more entertaining and there was much more use
of the home as a place for entertainment than there is
today. You didn't get together and go out to eat. You got
together and everybody in the neighborhood brought a dish
over and you ate at one person's house. I remember that.
STUMBERG
G: A lot of changes, anyway. Not necessarily for the
better if I read into -
S: Well, but that's an opinion.
G: But you've had a lot of changes for the good, too.
S: Certainly, and I'm not saying I'd go back.
20
S: There certainly is, a lot of 'changes and not that many
years.
G: Absolutely true.
The city itself, you've been here your whole life. I
first came to San Antonio in 1967. It's almost a different
world than it was then; it was twenty years ago. The size
of the city; the hustle-bustle of the city.
S: You came to San Antonio at a time that I would say was
really the start of the San Antonio that we know today. San
Antonio, prior to that, was completely, or almost
completely, an over-grown small Texas town with an
abnormally large number of people in the town.
I really believe that the political administration here
that embraced HemisFair, conceived HemisFair in 1968 ..• the
entire city was set in a different direction at that time.
Of course, the change was not instantaneous but I think ••.
For instance I can remember graduating from high school
in 1963 and the feeling pretty much at that point in time
was if the family didn't own a business here, that was
established today and all the building, that if you intended
to make a success of your life, you had better not look at
coming back to San Antonio.
STUMBERG 21
S: I'm not saying that was universal, nothing is universal
'" but there was a tremendous number of people that felt
that way. A lot of older people will tell you you'd better
look somewhere else.
I think HemisFair, that era, things began to turn
around in that matter. Now, I know a lot of people that
were unable to come back to San Antonio when they graduated
from college, who wanted to but employment opportunity
wasn't here, who have since come back. Opportunities, now
obviously we're not a Dallas or Los Angeles or Houston by
any means, but there is a lot more opportunity today than
there was at that point of time.
G: Not necessarily want to be in New York or Dallas.
S: No. (laughter)
G: So a
active today.
lot of changes. You're in the business world,
Is that going to continue, do you think?
S: Well, as you know, as we speak, San Antonio's economy
is not the best that it's ever been. We are depressed as a
result of decreasing price of oil and resulting activity in
that market. A terrible loss of financial strength in our
national institutions and local bills languish at this
point. I think ~ that in the long run we have a great
deal to offer. I'm not nearly smart enough to know what's
going to happen. It will be slow returning to economic
vitality. We'll get there, I'm not sure that in my lifetime
we'll see another real estate market like we had.
I think San Antonio's future is excellent as our labor
force becomes more educated. I think we are an attractive
STUMBERG 22
S: alternative. Certainly, we are a city that people seem
to like when they come here. We have certain dynamic
problems on the horizon •.. water possibly being one of
them.
But if you look at one of the major cities across the
country, I suppose our problems overall aren't as bad as
G: I guess philosphically having the problem isn't the
issue; being able to work is what keeps the city vital and
keeps it going.
S: Yeah. I think one of the things that has worked well
for the city of San Antonio is, compared to other cities
that I've looked at, an on-going workable city council has
been able to face in the same direction over a number of
years •.•
G: In the time that I've been here it seems like UTSA for
example, has come along and grown. Isn't the existence of a
growing university like that a plus for the city?
S: Oh, I would say unquestionably it's probably not only a
plus but it will be a real factor as a major city it's a
necessity .. if you don't have a good education available at
a reasonable price, you hinder your citizens as well as the
fact a university attracts so many satellite opportunities
or benefits that are not directly classroom efforts. The
Health Science Center may be one of the real unsung gems
that we've got. And I suspect that the future will show
that has been one that San Antonio is extremely fortunate to
have that facility here. We have a lot to work for.
STUMBERG 23
S: Like I say, we've got problems. A lot of them.
G: Sure. Between UTSA and The Health Science Center I
know you see, I see anyway, changes in the basic make-up of
San Antonio. It's more opportunity; more diversity I guess
is the word that I want, than I saw when I came here.
S: There's no comparison. You came right at the end of
the time period that I would catalog as having little or no
opportunity. The city was not growth-minded. In fact, the
power structure within the city was candidly, anti-growth.
The city fathers that turned it around and established a
growth position were really frowned upon by a lot of the
establishment here at that point in time. And I think we're
probably .. we're certainly the other direction now .. much
more growth-oriented and I suspect that within one more
generation we will have basicallY lost much of any influence
out of that conservative small town ••.
G: Let's go back for a minute: you mentioned you
graduated from Jefferson [High School] in '63. Where did
you go from there?
S: Went to SMU; graduated from SMU with a degree in
Business Administration. Went on subsequently to the New
York Institute of Finance. Basically, since 1972, have been
operating income producing properties; small, more or less
things that nobody else is interested in. (laughter)
G: So in the business community and have been since you
came back from SMU and the New York School of Finance?
S: Right. I spent 8 years out of San Antonio in Dallas at
school; New York; a short period working in Seguin. But
STUMBERG
S: other than that stretch of time, all my life in San
Antonio.
G: I take it from that, you intend to stay and the
Stumberg chain will continue here?
24
S: I don't play God but I would tell you that this is the
first generation - I don't necessarily see my kids staying
in San Antonio.
G: That's interesting.
S: They do not •.• they're a product of what I was talking
about.
G: Mobile?
S: They're a product of a mobile society; a society that
doesn't have a sense of neighborhood anymore; a society
that, in which they have been educated and are being
educated, they probably realize more that not everything is
in San Antonio.
When I left for college; I thought that San Antonio was
the center of the world; the rest of the world revolved
around it. And I see this with children in other families
that have very well established families here, this
generation of children does not seem nearly as tied to San
Antonio as past generations have tried to be. That desire
to be in San Antonio; to stay in San Antonio isn't nearly as
strong.
G: Is that good or bad? Or is it neither?
S: Well, I don't think it's either. I am a person who
believes that the most successful human being in the world
is a human being who can buy an adding machine.
STUMBERG 25
G: Absolutely.
S: That's what I want for my children; whether it's in San
Antonio or .••
G: I guess as you look back on the Stumberg family, Herman
Deitrich certainly got up and left, didn't he?
S: Hopefully, my kids want to get away for different
reasons. If you look at our world today we knew. We know
instantaneously what's happening in any part of the world.
The world isn't our frontier anymore; we've got to look at
other planets.
G: Good point. Good point.
S: Our neighborhood is really the world; we all look at it
that way today. We are as familiar with what's happening in
Teheran, almost today, as we were what was happening a block
away when I was ten years old.
G: Well put. As we close this thing, is there anything we
haven't touched on that might be a part of this for the sake
of posterity? as we put a close to this intereview?
S: Not that I can think of.
G: Well, with that, I'll put a wrap on this. I just want
to say one more time I thank you for your time out of a
very busy schedule and I appreciate the opportunity.
S: Thanks, Donald.
END OF TAPE I, SIDE 2, ABOUT 20 MINUTES.