THE INSTITUTE OF TEXAN CULTURES
ORAL HISTORY PROGRAM
INTERVIEW WITH: Arthur H. Kowert
September 16, 1987
Fredericksburg, Texas
Bill & Precious Gregg,
DATE:
PLACE:
INTERVIEWERS:
G: This is the 16th of September, 1987, in Fredericksburg,
Texas. We are about to interview Mr. Arthur H. Kowert, who
was the mainspring behind the local newspaper, which is now
called - is it the combined name, Mr. Kowert?
K: The Fredericksburg Standard Radio Post, yes.
G: When I come down with many more newspapers, you haven't
got too long to say it.
K: No. This is the only combination we have. We are
successors, too, but not combined with anybody else.
G: So, in other words, from here on out the kind of thing
we'd like is what you put on here, "Old Times in
Fredericksburg" - anything at all that you c an remember,
things that used to be, what you heard oldtimers say before
that, etc.
PG: What traditions they might be carrying on still. 'Cause
you certainly print that in you paper.
K: Well, of course, Fredericksburg is a great traditional
town in that the events and the activities that were started
way back when the first settlers arrived here are still
being
KOWERT 2
K: carried on today. Of course, everybody has heard of
what they call the "old time Schuetzen Fest, or Shooting
Fest" and also the singing festivals that's in German are
known as the Sanger Festival.
In the early days the Schuetzen Fest got started when
pioneers were going out hunting and things like that and
eventually it developed into a marksmanship contest. They
started firing at different things and eventually got out
their targets and stuff and started firing at real targets.
In fact, some of the first targets, and there are still some
of them around, were - I know of one that's on an old steel
plate, and another that's an old ironstone rock.
And they each year have this major festival in August
in which up to 100 marksmen get together and they fire at a
target at a distance of 200 yards and the most coveted honor
they can acquire, of course, is that of Schuetzen King, or
King of the Festival. They each fire 10 shots and the
perfect shot, of course, is 10, and if they make a score of
100, why they have a perfect score, and they've got a good
many in recent years that have made a score o f 100.
BG: They're using modern guns
K: They're using modern guns. They've gotten away from
the - there are still a good many that load their own
shells, of course.
BG: That's common practice, I understand.
K: Yes. And, of course, it's some of the oldtimers have
gotten away from it. It used to be - they always set
KOWERT 3
K: the things, they schedule them for the end of July and
beginning of August, because usually there's a full moon at
that time. And they would arrive in their hacks and
buggies, and of course , camp out over night. And they
didn ' t want to do that when it wasn't a ful l moon because
they couldn't find their way around, and things.
And also they used to have big dances, but , in this day
and time, most of them are just pure shooting festivals.
They have no other kind of celebrations with them. And, of
cour se , the most coveted thing about these festivals was
when they actually crown the King. They lift them up on
their backs and throw them in the air , and •..••
PG: Just like a football player!
K: Yeah. Just like a football player. (laughter) And, of
course, t he singing festivals were much the same way. They
have - we still have two predominantly German singing choirs
in the community that are made up of men, mostly men. We
have what they call the "Maennerchor" , which is a men ' s
chorus. And the Gemischtechor, which is a choir composed of
men and women. And they each year have a big singing
festival at the - in September. They have one - they go to
different cities to have these. This year they're going t o
be in San Antonio. September 27th at the Hermann's Sons
Hall.
PG: Uh- huh. We ' ve gone there for some of the Fiesta Time,
when they've had the singing and the dancing.
KOWERT 4
K: Yes. Of course, they're really going to have the
topnotch ones next year. It's going to be in Fredericksburg
and a choir from Germany will be here.
PG: Oh, wonderful.
BG: That's a small place they're planning on having that
K: Yes. Hermann's Sons is.
BG: Why do you suppose ••••.
K: Well, it's traditional, that's what it is. Really and
truly they are not as large as they used to be, the singing
festivals. The main object o f the choirs, of course, is for
people to get together and have a good time- sing •••.•
BG: We sing in our choir at St. Luke's Episcopal Church so
when you mention this singing, we're wondering what was
coming on, hoping we would have the chance to go listen.
K: Well. I don't know if it would be that outstanding to
you. But they're going to have some fun.
PG : Well, I think German people particularly know how to
have fun.
K: Yes. That's correct.
PG : After they have worked real hard and certainly up here
you have to work hard to make a living.
K: Well, that, of course, is one thing about
Fredericksburg . It's really amazing how through the years
we have maintained these f est ivals. You take our county
fair here is one of the oldest in the State , if not t he
oldest . And you would often think that, as the years roll
KOWERT 5
K: on , you know, the thing would die out. But there are
always young people that come along and pitch in and keep
the ball rolling. Years ago the fair was different than it
is today. They used to always call it a t hree-ring circus.
They would have the horse races and then they would have a
baseball game during the races and everytime a race was run,
they all quit playing baseball and run up to the fence and
watch the horses run.
And then they'd have a band concert in between and
other action things. It was a real show. Nowadays it's -
the fair has developed into a horse racing event and also
one of the major livestock shows in the area. It's just
gone in that direction.
Of course, they moved the old fairgrounds. It used to
be just 2 blocks south of Main Street and now they've moved
it about 2 miles out State Highway 16. They have a very
spacious fairground.
PG: Where do the horses come from for the racing?
K: They come from horse breeders from - these people
belong to a racing circuit and they go from one race to the
other. They have races in Boerne and Bandera and, oh ,
different cities around the area.
PG: How long has that been
K: Oh, the horse racing?
PG: Uh-huh.
K: Well, in the early days, they had gig races here.
PG: Oh. Did they?
BG: Gig races. Now, that is a harness race, isn't it?
KOWERT 6
K: Yes.
I can remember watching them when I was a kid sitting
on top of the fence, outside of the fairgrounds, of course,
watching them run. And it was really something.
PG: Well, that's always been a part of it up here.
K: Yes. The horse racing has always been a part of it. A
very important part of it, too.
PG: So that meant you would try to keep a fine running
horse as well as working horses on your farm.
K: Well, really, not so many horses came from right around
here. Of course, you know we had one of the most important
horse racing training places was Morris Ranch. Have you
heard of it?
BG: Personally, no.
PG: We're not ranchers, so
K: Well, the Morris Ranch was established by some wealthy
people by the name of Morris who lived in New York, and felt
this would be an ideal place to raise and train race horses.
And they purchased a huge amount of property along the
Pedernales River about 15 miles south up here and built a
little community by the name of Morris Ranch. And such
famous men as Max Heroish, I don't know if you've ever heard
of him, he got a start out at Morris Ranch raising horses.
And so did Willie Mulder, who was another big horse race
trainer. And they actually train horses out there. And, of
course, the community is still there. But like all small
communities, it once had a thriving school, and had a post
KOWERT 7
K: office, and had a big store and - but it, too, is no
longer a thriving community. But it's a nice little central
gathering place.
BG: Like Luckenbach.
K: What about Luchenbach?
BG: About the size of Luckenbach.
K: Yes, that's correct. There's not quite as much activity
out there as there is at Luckenbach. Have you been at
Luckenbach?
BG: Just remember reading about it in the papers, about
that character that was the mayor of Luckenbach. And about
this festival when the Beer Boppers carne back.
K: Well. They had some high-flying times down there. It
changed the complexion of the town entirely because it was
as quiet and as docile a place as you've ever seen.
BG: Welfare. I think that would tie anyplace.
K: How?
BG: Welfare, Texas.
PG: That's near Comfort, Texas. That's a quiet town.
K: Yes. I have been there long, long ago.
BG: One building. Well, I wanted to ask your version - the
Easter Fires. Because we hear as docents, they tell us
things to tell the kiddie groups when they come from the
schools, you know . And they hear two versions since they've
been here, and I wonder what your version is.
K: What do you mean, by what is my version?
BG: Well, the Easter Fires is supposed to have some
KOWERT 8
BG: significance. How did they start, and what are they
supposed to represent?
PG: Are they legend, or are they facts?
K: Well, they're a little bit of both. For many, many
years, the only thing resembling the Easter Fires that was
held here were actually the fires on the hills. We had a
man here by the name of William Petnachy who was Postmaster.
Have you ever heard of him?
BG: No.
K: Well, it so happened that I was among the group that
first got together and I was, of course, pulling for it. I
think that San Antonio Express and we each Easter, would
send out stories, talking about the Easter Fires. And, of
course, Petnachy could really weave a fancy story, and he
couldn't gather the story of the Easter Fires. And he, of
course, wrote a book on it.
seen it.
PG: No, we have not.
I don't know whether you've
K: I'll give you one. And he got together and he said,
"You know really all these people come up here" and they
would come up here and they'd drive around in this - they'd
come up on a Saturday evening and the town would be crowded
with people and what they would do, is they would go up and
down Main Street and go out in the country side near Cross
Mountain and watch the Easter Fires and there would be fires
on the hill.
So he decided that we should go on and have a pageant
commemorating the Easter Fires. And, of course, what he
KOWERT 9
K: actually did was - the end of the story, he wove t he
tale of the Easter Fi re based on the fact that they
originated when people saw these fires on the hills and they
were afraid they were Indian fires and that the Indian
tribes were signaling each other to attack Fredericksburg,
or something like that. And then, of course, why instead of
that, they said, "No , that's the Easter Bunny dying his eggs
up on the hill". And, of course, that word was •....
BG: That's the one we hear as docents at the Institute of
Texan Cultures .
K: They say the same thing, huh?
BG: It's the one they have us telling the kiddie - poos when
they come through.
K: Yes. Well, t hat's actually - it's mor e legend than
anything else, of course. But it's a very pleasant and
entertaining legend. And it' s been a tremendous attraction
and crowd p l easer. Because these kids get dressed up as
bunnies and stuff.
And there ' s something real strange. I had a daughter
than lived in Germany , in Hamburg. And we were running
around in Hamburg one day and I picked up a booklet in a
German publ ishing house there and they spoke of the Easter
Fires in Hamburg, Germany, on the Elbe River. And where
that came from over there , every spring they would gather
the driftwood and things that came up on the River and t hey
would put it in a huge fi r e . And on the night before
East er , they would burn it.
I'm trying to think of the name of the litt le town but
KOWERT 10
K: I can't think of it. It was •. •..
BG : Did you push the embers over the cliff, then you know
what's - some Indian tribe does that here. They have a big
fire up there and at the proper time, they push all the
embers over the cliff so there's a waterfall of embers from
the fire.
K: Well, that sounds like a pretty good idea.
BG: You mentioned a full moon awhile ago. And that brings
to mind - do you know when the first Masonic Lodge was
established because originally you know, they were country
lodges and they travelled when the full moon was in bloom.
K: I really do not have any knowledge of that, to be
absolutely honest.
PG: You can see why they would want the moon to see where
they were going . (laughter)
BG: They'd come in with their families , gather around , and
they'd come in and - usually the Saturday before the full
moon.
K: It makes sense .
BG: Well •••••
PG: We really haven't talked to anybody about what the work
was that the women did while all the men were doing the
farming. Of course , I assume that the women were helping
with t he farming , too, because they didn't have that many
people to work in the farm, except the children.
K: Well, that's correct. I, of course , was never a farmer
and never lived on a farm, but, of course, in those days,
just like all over the wor ld, the women took care of the
KOWERT l l
K: house and they did the cooking and the sewing and I
know, I'm sure, they worked in the fields , and did
everything else they could do to help their menfolks along .
BG : I've heard they also bore the children. (laughter)
K: That's right. And lots of them had many c hil dren .
PG: Yes, they really did. And, of course , they needed them
to help with the farm.
K: You asked what the women did. They used t o - you k now
nowadays they don't thrash grain like they used to . They'd
have these huge thrashing machines that work - I worked - I
worked on one or two of them - the chaff and the hay and the
stuff got my hay fever and started my allergies up.
But now if you want - think of someone having a feast -
they'd have these crews, you know , that would come and
thrash and they'd have the darndest feast you ever saw. All
the women would get together and follow the men around and -
it was really an occasion. But, as I say , nowadays, of
course, they go around with a tractor and do all the - all
that work.
PG: Well, the women here seem to have such wonderful crafts
with their h a nds . Their qu ilting , you j ust see all over
town, and I wonder i f they brought that from Germany with
them, or •••.•
K: Well, they d i d. And , of course , another thing that ' s
happening here is a good many of the churches organizations
have qui l t ing organ i zations . One of them parti cul arl y , i s a
Lutheran Church - Holy Ghost Lutheran Church here in town,
has had a quilting society for as long as I can remember .
KOWERT 12
K: And they used to meet weekly. I know my mother is a
member of the organization. That was one afternoon she
would be gone to qui lting. They, of course, have made
quilts for - on order for people who wanted them and sell it
to 'ern. If one of their children got married, or so , they'd
all make - pitch together and make quilts for the children.
BG: Wonderful wedding present.
PG : And a marvelous way to v isit while you were working,
too.
I asked Mr. Cox about the people helping each other to
build houses, and , of course, quilting was helping each
other and didn't they get together and cook?
K: Oh, yes. Yes. And they 'd get together and cook. Of
course, another thing they used to do in the olden days and
this carne up some time back - making their own - doing their
own butchering and making their own sausage and things like
that.
Of course, back in the olden days, they had to wait
until the weather was right . They had to wait until it was
cold and they could do their butchering and their sausage
making. And they would often go from place to place and
butcher and help each other out doing that and I'm sure they
had common equipment - sausage stuff ing machines , different
items like that that they shared with each other. Oh, yes,
the re's a lot of that that went on, too .
PG: Well , they carne to grape country , so they could always
make wine . They found grapes here in Texas .
KOWERT 13
K: It's real odd, it's taking quite a twist. Now we're
getting a lot of wineries in Texas. We have a vey fine
winery here now.
PG: What is the name of that?
K: Oh, the Hellman Winery.
tours every Saturday out here.
Fredericksburg.
He has wine tasting and winery
He's about 15 miles north of
BG: The papers, you say, are combined now, but we didn't say
when the first paper started going.
K: The Fredericksburg Standard as such was actually
founded about 1907. We claim our paper goes back, I think,
about 1888 when the first English paper was printed here.
We also printed a German paper for many years. But in 1905
a man started the Standard and in 1915 this present firm,
the Fredericksburg Publishing Company, which was then
publishing a German paper, bought the Fredericksburg
Standard and started to print both of them.
And the Standard and the German paper was named the
Welten Blatta Weekly Sheet, were the only papers in town
until about 1923 when a former editor of the Standard
started a paper that was known - only known as the Radio
Post. And in 1984, we purchased that paper and combined the
two.
PG: We're trying to think of other things. I'm sure that
you helped with publicity for all of the activities that go
on here. Are you a source for other newspapers, too?
K: Not any more.
PG: About happenings.
KOWERT 14
K: No. Not any more. That can be quite a chore, and
really it's - I've - I guess for 30 years I was a
correspondent for the - a stringer for the Express but that
gets to be a chore. And really, the daily papers have
gotten away from it. They have very few of them. Now our
current editor, Terry Collier, the only thing that really
.•••• is football scores and sports items and they all have
stringers for that. But it's odd how they've gotten away
from having stringers in small towns. We get very little
publicity in those newspapers, and if we do, it's something
we're not very proud of.
PG: Yes. It's something that's bad, rather than something
that 's constructive.
Well , we notice how much the orchards have built up
around here.
K: Yes. That has been a tremendous expansion, of course.
Years ago a man by the name of B.L . Enderley - well, he was
really the high school science teacher. He started planting
a few peach trees and developed an orchard and he was really
the father of the orchards.
PG: She didn't tell us about that when we talked to her -
K: Mrs. Nixon.
PG: Yes . We talked about a lot of things so it was just
not something that she went into , but this is such good
fruit tree growing country. Have they had pecans up here
all the time, to?
K: Yes. Pecans. I have a few pecans myself, but I tell you
KOWERT 15
K: I've often said if the farmer had to make their living
according to the way I grow pecans, they'd have a hard time
of it.
BG: I meant to ask. When you were talking about newspapers
- stringers. We're not newspaper persons. Stringers imply
something or other but that means because they used the
wires, or
K: Well, I don't know. I guess you got 'em on the
string reporting news to you. That's the only thing - I've
always heard them called that. Here the papers themselves
call you their correspondents - country correspondents,
rural correspondents, whatever you want to ••••.
PG: Well, Bill McReynolds, on San Antonio radio so often
advertises Gillespie County then you've got some growers
that he names that the orchards are ready f or picking. So
publicity definitely is there.
K: Oh, yeah. Well, of course, we are just astounded by the
amount of publicity that Fredericksburg gets. It' s in the
magazines and just about- we get more ••.•• get more
publicity for nothing than most people can buy. And, of
course, it's - when you r eally come to look at it, it's -
the main thing responsible for it, of course, is that
Frede ricksburg has taken care of its heritage. And we
retain our buildings and things have happened to where it
was caught in the nick of time before we los t too many
things.
Now I really think that our development,
KOWERT 16
K: historically, is due to the fact that in 1932 or '33 in
the depths of the depression you know they had Works
Progress Administration deals, and things like that. It
•.••• matching funds to give you money, well we had this old
PG:
BG:
K:
well, Mrs. Nixon may have told you about that.
Didn't hear how it was obtained.
That was the •.••. of the WPA?
Well. They offered them some money but they had to have
a sponsoring organization that would oversee it, you know.
They just - I guess it could have been, it was just before I
started working in the newspaper and so they needed a
sponsoring organization so they formed the Gillespie County
Historical Society. And they were a bunch of women that
were in their prime and had the love of Fredericksburg at
heart and ••.••
PG: Determination.
K: Determination, and went ahead and did it. And they
built that church - that replica of that church and from
then on, well, people started taking a greater interest in
history.
Of course, that was con - I think the church was
finally dedicated in 19 - the building was dedicated in
1936.
But then there was really a period in there when -
after - immediately after World War II when the trend here
was like everywhere else. It was kind of getting to where -
well, it's getting more modern and stuff like that. Put up
KOWERT 17
K: buildings with fancy fronts and modern fronts and things
on it. And then all of a sudden they came back and realized
how valuable these old buildings were and they started
restoring the old buildings - fixing up and that. Of course,
that, I guess started in the mid-60's or something like
that.
PG: That was very fortunate. I see you had the pleasure of
knowing Admiral Nimitz.
K: I sure did. Yeah. Yeah, he was .•.••
BG: Some people claim that to be a pleasure; others weren't
quite so sure. I thought - I admit he was a great man, but,
I mean as far as a pleasure is concerned ••• (laughter)
K: When I started working in 1934 - I think it was in 1936,
we had an old-time editor that was - would not leave the
building to do an interview. If anybody wanted a story in
his newspaper, he had to come up here and be interviewed.
So some relatives of Nimitz said, "Well, you know, Rear
Admiral Nimitz is going to be in town next week and he's
going to be visiting with his relatives in the Nimitz Hotel.
And don't you think that you ought to have somebody down
there to talk to the man?" And I tell you I went to the
editor, and I said, "Now, Mr. Kleck, don't you think you
ought to go down?" He said, "No, sir!" He said, "If you
want to go, you can go and I'm not going down there." I
said , "Okay, I'll go."
So I went down there. Here that man was with about - and
he had various relatives under every rock here. And I went
KOWERT 18
K: down there and one of the - a friend of mine, who was
his cousin, introduced me and I said, "I'd like to speak to
him." And he said in a few minutes, "Well, just a minute."
He said, "I'm going to - I have to visit my relatives a few
minutes. You just sit down." So I sat down, about 30
minutes later, he came over to me and that man stood there -
sat there - and talked to me for an hour.
PG: Oh, how marvelous!
K: And that was just about enough to convince me that all
great men are great men because of how common they are and,
of course, I found that out, too, later on. We were -
Nimitz was a man that that's the first time in my life I
ever had to - metropolitan press corps in Fredericksburg
enmass.
You know, he made this Victorious. I don't know if you
remember that or not. You know af t er the War he made this
tour of America - Victorious Tour. And this was the final
stop. That was the final stop. And we had people here from
Associated Press, all the Capital Press was out of Austin
and that was the first - that's when we really started
getting publicity 'cause, you know, he was really a common
man in his •••••
PG: Uh-huh. Very unassuming.
K: And he was - his birthplace is still down here. It's
now an antique shop. I t ' s well preserved. But I can still
picture myself s tanding in front of there - i n front under
the porch and Nimitz was coming into the building with his
entourage and these press corps people were crowding around
KOWERT 19
K: him. He said, "I want to tell you something, boys, I'm
home now, and we don't need you in this house. I'll be out
in about 30 minutes and continue." And then later on he
sent word out that - there were 2 newspapers, said the other
newspaper and I could come in now. We could take some
pictures inside "just the way you want it."
He came back several times after that. Of course, the
next big great was when Johnson became President. You know,
he took a great liking to Frdericksburg.
It's all been rather exciting.
BG: It has indeed. I do not want to rush this because
thoughts come to mind slowly. So if they're still coming to
mind we want to sit here. On the other hand, we know you're
busy.
K:
PG:
We don't want to take up your time any longer.
No, I'm not in that big of a rush.
Let me ask you. Do you know when they started the
historical markers of Texas? That's something, and I don't
know if there is a book with every historical marker
listed.
BG: Ann says there is not. She is going to try to look up
- interest somebody to do it.
K: I think there is. I'm not sure. Now •••••
PG: 'Cause that's made it so much more fascinating to go on
the road. I can't remember when I first started looking.
He
K: ••••• My wife refuses to be interviewed. I don't know
if you know about her or not. She's written a couple of
KOWERT
K: books on Fredericksburg.
PG: Oh. No, but •••••
20
K: Historical Homes and Buildings in Fredericksburg - 2
different volumes. And she ••••• I thought we had that in
one of our- we've produced several together •.•••
BG: What's Ann's last name?
PG: Ferguson.
BG: Ann Ferguson would like to know about it. She said
that now the State Highway Department has a - just a list.
What she wants is a book that are numbered somehow so if you
are going out on some route, you look up this page - Page
XDX and sees what the markers say and you don't have to stop
your driving to read the markers.
K: That 's not the object of the marker.
PG: That 's right , to stop •••••
K: Well , I jus t think we have something on it.
PG: I guess State Highways, she said •••••
K: Fredericksburg is - our County is supposed to have as
great a number as any county in the State according to its
population and size. I 'm sure that ' s correct. We have one
of those things put up every - ever so often.
BG: Something new came up when we were talking to Mr . Ty
Cox . He said, "The Mormons were here." He said he didn't
know how long before. He didn ' t think it was long before
but he felt the Mormons were here for the sawmill and the
grist mill when the Germans arrived. And, therefore, they
were able to help the Germans by giving them sawmill cut
KOWERT 21
K: planks, and so forth.
K: Well. That's correct. I do not think they were here
before the Germans.
PG: That would be interesting to research. That was
BG: He said there's an historical marker on the edge of
town, so we thought we'd go and take a look and see what it
says on the marker.
K: About the Mormon settlement?
BG: Uh-huh.
K: There's not one on the edge of town. There's one out
in the middle of the field but you can't get to, the man
won't let people in there any more.
BG: He said that's a cemetery. He said there is -he
claimed. There is one of these markers, he said , you go
about a mile and a half on the Austin Highway and there's
a rest stop. He said you go in there, and there's an
historical marker.
PG: Well, that's a state marker identifying the area.
BG: Yeah. He told us about the cemetery. He said it's in
the middle of a field and he's afraid it's mostly destroyed
by now.
K: It is. I've been out there.
PG: Oh. Uh-huh.
K: I'm just trying to think when it was. It hasn ' t been
that long ago really. But the man will not let anybody in
there, and you can't blame him. Regardless of how - I just
KOWERT 22
PG: Privacy is a difficult thing.
K: Well, they would tear down his fences and leave junk
all over. It's just almost unbelievable •••••
BG: Also, somewhere along the line, he let some historical
organization come in once, at least , to look at the
tombstones for •.••.
K: Well, I know there's only one stone there.
BG: Only one stone there?
K: I was there for the first time about 45 years ago. And
there was a little - a little plat of trees with this
marker. And I can still remember. And then, I don't know,
something made me go out there and he let me come out there
and take a picture under one condition that I would not say
where it was, on whose place it was.
PG: Did that go in your wife's book?
K: No. It was in the newspaper.
PG: Oh.
K: And I can't remember. And I'm sorry, but I just can't
.....
PG: Well. It's intersting. I didn't even know they had a
settlement here in Texas.
K: Let me get the book - here we have it. Maybe I can
find something. I know its spot. Here in 1847 about 200
Mormons including men, women and children located. And
that's about the time. And Fredericksburg was founded in
about 1846. But they were certainly of great importance in
furnishing lumber and other things to the early settlers.
KOWERT 23
K: And, of course, Lymon Wight was the leader of the group
that came. He served as chief justice of this county for a
year and a half or so. And , of course, they were located on
the river and several floods wiped them out.
BG: You'd better get at least 40 feet over the river.
K: Yeah. That's right.
BG: Vertical. So many wonderful books to read.
K: Yes.
BG: If you sat in your chair all day long every day and
read the books you couldn't keep up.
K: You'd wear yourself out and - not wear yourself out but
- here are some of the - that's one of the books my wife
produced. And that was in - we used that as a feature in
our newspaper in the early 1950's. Each week we'd select an
old home in town. And interview people that lived there.
And knew how they were built and everything. And it was
amazing at that time there were some second and third
generation people or even first generation that knew a good
deal about the house.
And then we .••• • it in the newspaper as a bicentennial
feature. And people started clamoring. They said they were
saving - clipping each one of the stories, wouldn't we put
it out in a book. So we did. She actually - we actually
put out two books, but the second one is now out of print.
BG: If she gets the full name of that book on here, it
could be the Institute knows about it , could be they don ' t.
K: Yeah. The title of it is "Old Homes and Buildings of
KOWERT
K: Fredericksburg" by Lisa Kowert and the other one is
"Historic Homes and Buildings in and Around
Fredericksburg."
PG: You have so many craftsmen and women who came to
Fredericksburg.
24
K: Yes. Of course, really and truly the people that first
settled here were pretty educated people and they were
craftsmen in their own right when they got here. And then,
of course , a lot of them having developed this craft to put
up their homes and furniture and do other things required to
get a going settlement.
BG: Yes. Playing the violin and enjoying the opera is
wonderful and it's necessary but you don't eat on that
K: Yes. That's right.
BG: That book will be quite a source of reference, could be
they already know about it at the Institute, but if they
don ' t, they will soon.
PG: Was there much fish in the river - in the Pedernales
River?
K: Well, of course , they claim that ' s why Morris and his
group decided to settle here. That they got up here to the
confluence of these two creeks that run through - the river
and there was a lot of wild game, and of course, there still
is. I mean turkey and deer and it looked like fertile land
and they were fishing the streams too , of course, and that's
undoubtedly why they decided to come here. That's what
KOWERT 25
K: history tells us.
PG: Well, certainly water is something we're learning to
appreciate more and more and I wish we weren't as wasteful
with it.
K: Yeah. That's true.
PG: Well, we have learned a lot from you too. And
certainly you have been somebody to blow the trumpet in
town. (laughter)
BG: Got a book printed!
K: That's right. Well, that's the way we look a t putting
out our newspaper. We think it's really the - the ongoing
history of a community when you just - you can have your
official records and everything else but I've often said
that's it is really the historical record of a community,
and it is. If you do your job the way you're supposed to.
PG: Well , Mr. Cox was telling us about the makeup of the
buildings and what fi ne groundwork the Germans laid, so that
the houses did remain standing and we ••..•
K: We had that experience with this very own building.
Oh, it's been over 20 years ago that the area we're sitting
in was a men's store. And our building - the newspaper
plant - was the portion of the building between here and the
other wall. And we had these -we got a bid on having -we
had to combine these two buildings. In other words, cut
open here, cut an opening there and cut out a portion in the
back and make it one building. And they came around here
and checked the walls and these carpenters were here. They
KOWERT 26
K: were going to do it. And they estimated this was a 13
inch wall here. It had some wood facing on the other side
of it. And when they got in and they started knocking out
that wall, that wall was 23 inches thick of solid limestone
rock.
No, the buildings were really constructed to last.
There's . . . . .
BG: In the old country they built them to last. And
apparently they lived in them for a thousand years. We saw
the same thing in Europe - in England. Some of the houses
are so old and like that. But over here, if your house gets
that old, they tear it down and build a new one . So what's
the use.
K: I was in Basle, Switzerland and I never will forget it.
It was the first trip I ever made over there. I had a son
1n Basle and daughter in Hamburg so I visited both of them.
Walking down the street in Basle the first day we were there
and there was a number up on the side of the house and I
said to my son, "How do you number your streets? It looks
like 1349 up there." He said, "That's not a house number,
that's when that place was built!" Have you ever been in
Brauslaw? (Brulisau ?)
BG: Been all around Europe, I was in the Navy, but I
haven't been inside of it.
K: I was fortunate to have a daughter that lived in
Germany and London and then came back to Germany.
And the son was doing ••••. to work and headed the
KOWERT 27
K: Chemistry Institute at Basle, Switzerland. And so we
visited and I tell you there's a lot of towns I'd like to go
back to and that's certainly one of them.
world.
It's a different
PG: I went up with an aunt who was living in Munich and we
went to
Bavaria and that georgeous view!
in between Austria and
I wanted to go to
Switzerland, too, and see some of the other parts, but we
never did have the time.
K: Well, of course, you never do have enough time. It's -
if you have a family over there, somebody you can stay with ,
it's convenient, and yet you don't often see as much as you
would if you're with a tour group.
PG: That's true because you get to the places.
K: But you know , I enjoyed England as much as I did
Germany.
BG: I loved England. We were there for 2 years with a
family.
K: My daughter lived in Bromley in Kent.
PG: Well, we were down in Surrey.
(tape is blank from here to the end)
END OF SIDE 1, TAPE 1, ABOUT 40 MINUTES.